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Author Topic: When did G1 end for you?  (Read 2719 times)

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Offline LightningBolt

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #20 on: April 19, 2018, 08:25:53 PM »
I can agree with the dislike of Spectra's gossiping which is why I liked Haunted so much. She sees what her nosiness did to others. My biggest beef in regrards to characters was the violent background of many of the main characters. I actually researched every character for my then 6 yr old who has always been drawn to the darker stuff of the world, so I did not allow many of the main characters to come home; Lagoona was probably the one of the original ghouls that I okayed. As she got older we bought dolls like Clawdeen and Ghoulia.
 
As a collector I liked the dolls. Some lines were cheesy but still cute. The Line went downhill once they changed the face molds and articulation. Then instead of talking about school conflicts they went to babysitting and pet setting. Those are Barbie lines, Monster High was for OLDER girls the Tween market. Heaven Forbid a 10yr old puts down her iPhone long enough to play with dolls. Same with the sister line Ever After High. Once they changed the face molds, bodies, and articulation that line just isn't what it used to be.

That’s just it—because Spectra WAS a gossip, there was an opportunity in Haunted for her to change and mature as a character. People—even very good people—have character flaws. In the process of living, we make mistakes, learn from them, and struggle to be our best selves. But if everybody is just perfect and wonderful from the get-go (as heroes so often are in children’s entertainment), then that struggle—that thing that makes them relatable—is gone. It’s hard to feel anything for or learn anything from a character you can’t relate to, and even children pick up on that. That’s why I find it kind of sad that a character was axed from a show/toyline because she wasn’t “perfect”. :(

I agree that it’s very sad how MH’s original target demographic just wasn’t interested in dolls. :( It sounds cliched, but it seems like kids are trying to grow up more and more quickly in recent years. Smartphones certainly didn’t help matters, especially compounded with the advent of social media... When I was ten, I was still very much into dolls and toys. :shrug:
I'm still into dolls and toys. (Obviously)

But I played with my toys even as old as 15, and being online didn't deter me from playing at all! Granted, 09 was a different atmosphere, but still.

Offline SaelaVe

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #21 on: April 19, 2018, 09:05:08 PM »
I apologize about that.  I was thinking that some girls might be into bugs, but now I realize maybe that's more for boys?  I really don't know.

I don't know.  When I was a little girl I loved bugs.  I used to spend hours watching earwigs crawl across my grandmother's patio.  And my daughter loves bugs as well.  We've caught her playing with wood lice, crickets, carpenter ants, and even an Oriental cockroach. :yucky:
On the flip-side of that: neither my husband nor my brother liked bugs when they were kids.  In fact, my husband had anxiety over insects when he was a little boy.  To this day he hates bugs, arachnids, rodents, and all reptiles.
So yeah, I'd be willing to venture that there are just as many little girls who like bugs as there are little boys, and just as many little boys who are afraid of bugs as there are little girls.

I know that there's just as many girls as boys that like bugs. I just mean it's not a typical thing for a doll line to cover.

Perhaps not.  But then again, even Mattel seems to think that bugs are appealing enough to little girls to include in their doll lines from time to time.  Garden Ghouls weren't the first, nor the last insect-themed dolls that they've released.

But in either case, bugs are definitely more of a little kid thing than a tween/teen thing, which is what I think Lynda was saying.

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2018, 09:36:58 AM »
Heck, I was in middle school and me and my friends wanted Neopets plushies.
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Offline Nemesis

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #23 on: April 20, 2018, 10:22:09 AM »
Heck, I was in middle school and me and my friends wanted Neopets plushies.

Haha, so did I! XD I remember being frantic because the Limited Too exclusives were so hard to find, lol.

I don’t think it’s really the internet itself that’s causing the decline in toy sales and creative play. I think it’s more to do with certain aspects of it, like social media, and the fact that phones and tablets now allow people to be joined to the web at all times. I’m certainly not against social media or mobile devices, but kids are notoriously bad at moderation.

Beyond that, peer pressure is now literally everywhere. Most of us have experienced that sad day, at some point in our lives, when we were teased for being “immature” because we still liked dolls, or plushies, or whatever. :( Kids have always tried to grow up too fast, but now the social pressure to do so is basically omnipresent. Our social lives follow us home, and half the time get broadcast across the internet by our peers. That’s scary to me, even as an adult. I can’t imagine going through that in middle school. *shudder*

At any rate, those are just my feelings on the matter. It’s a complicated issue, and there are no doubt many factors involved. It just makes me sad to think that kids are losing interest in traditional play at such young ages—play is such an essential part of developing creativity and critical thinking skills, IMO.

As to the topic at hand... I do feel like G1 sort of “semi-ended” for me when MH started marketing towards a younger audience. The spirit of the thing was kept mostly intact, but books, movies, and plots took a turn for the silly. My favorite incarnation of MH will always be the one where the clothes were edgier, the humor a touch sharper, and the characters had just a little more bite (as with Draculaura’s origin).
« Last Edit: April 20, 2018, 10:28:28 AM by Nemesis »

Offline SaelaVe

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #24 on: April 20, 2018, 11:39:21 AM »
Heck, I was in middle school and me and my friends wanted Neopets plushies.

Neopets was amazing back in the day!  I was in my early twenties and buying Neopets magazine, plushies, and the card game! :biggrin:


I don’t think it’s really the internet itself that’s causing the decline in toy sales and creative play. I think it’s more to do with certain aspects of it, like social media, and the fact that phones and tablets now allow people to be joined to the web at all times. I’m certainly not against social media or mobile devices, but kids are notoriously bad at moderation.

This!!

My five-year-old loves video games, but I have to monitor her time on devices or else she would be on them all day long.  It's not that she doesn't like toys.  In fact, once she starts playing with toys she plays with them for hours—but the same is true of video games and apps and YouTube videos.  It's up to me to monitor how much time she's spending on devices and to cut her off if need be.  She's a kid after all.  She has no concept that sitting in front of a computer all day long can be a bad thing.
Parents can't allow their children to spend hours upon hours every day on video games and social media and then blame technology for their kids' lack of interest in anything else.  That would be like only feeding your kids chicken nuggets and then claiming that it's Tyson's fault that your kid only eats chicken nuggets. :facepalm:

And let's be honest, back when many of us were kids it was the "boob tube" that was ruining us, taking us away from our toys and outdoor play.

Offline Wuvmykitties

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #25 on: April 20, 2018, 01:54:49 PM »
But in either case, bugs are definitely more of a little kid thing than a tween/teen thing, which is what I think Lynda was saying.

That was my point.  The themes are more geared toward little kids.  I miss the more detailed Fearleading outfits, the more detailed prom dresses, etc. 
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Offline Heart891011

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #26 on: May 06, 2018, 11:14:12 AM »
When they made those cheap unarticulated dolls with half printed dresses (Frankie GiGi Draculaura and Clawdeen if I am remembering correctly)

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #27 on: June 24, 2018, 04:53:58 PM »
The biggest glaring problem for me is that characters like Ghoulia are missing bc she's too scary (or so I've heard).  Spectra is missing but they replaced her with Ari, so I'm not sure why that move was made.

I think the reasons for removing those characters are even sadder than that. DX Ghoulia was widely criticized by soccer moms... They interpreted her as a negative stereotype about “smart girls”—awkward, bad posture, speech impediment, “ugly”... Yeah, she moans and has bad posture... she’s a ZOMBIE. DUH. (Maybe those moms will feel better about Disney Channel’s new singing, dancing “Zombies”, lol.)

As for Spectra, she was criticized for being a gossip, and thus setting a bad example for all the little angels of the world.

Wow, remember the stuff The Misfits used to get up to on Jem and the Holograms? I seem to recall them sabotaging the brakes on Jem’s car and almost sending her off a cliff, once. XD And yet no one demanded the Misfits dolls be changed or removed from production. We sure live in a more policed/censored world these days. :P

Yeah the Misfits did awful stuff but they were also clearly the villains. But Spectra is ostensibly supposed to be a good guy so she can't have any bad habits. Moanica does some awful stuff and it's ok since she's the villain.


Ok, so going to try and disentangle this.

Firstly, G1 ended for me when Ghoulia vanished.

Secondly, as a person with autism, I loved ghoulia and identified with her hugely as a character. Not least because she defies stereotypes by being an intelligent zombie. And I deal with misconceptions about what I can and cannot do and what autism is every day pretty much, so having a smart zombie who saves the world but who communicates in HER way, not in the expected norm way was amazing.

And on the Jem thing. The Misfits were withdrawn from Jem and replaced with the Stingers in part due to complaints about their violence from the same demographic, also their outfits, in particular fishnets on Stormer. So nothing changes.

Finally, on that same subject - the biggest villain in Jem is actually Jem herself, but because she's the good guy, she gets away with a lot of things that are morally questionable (steals, lies, cheats, tries to kill Pizzazz at least twice, to name but a few). The Misfits did bad stuff but were cast as bad guys - ultimately they are the more sympathetic characters because they're flawed and messed up. And they also have limits. A lot of the things that get blamed on them are actually done by Eric/Zipper or Eric/Techrat, whereas a lot of the negative Hologram acts are done by Jem or Jerrica directly.

Jem flew under the moral radar because she was the popular girl star character. Gossip, however, was associated in Jem with the Misfits stealing Kimber's diary. So Spectra being a gossip kind of jars with the 'good girl' image.

But if you;re going to replace Spectra, maybe replace her with a completely new character, not one that looks suspiciously like Spectra revamped with a new name...?
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Offline Wardah

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #28 on: June 26, 2018, 09:46:36 AM »
Finally, on that same subject - the biggest villain in Jem is actually Jem herself, but because she's the good guy, she gets away with a lot of things that are morally questionable (steals, lies, cheats, tries to kill Pizzazz at least twice, to name but a few). The Misfits did bad stuff but were cast as bad guys - ultimately they are the more sympathetic characters because they're flawed and messed up. And they also have limits. A lot of the things that get blamed on them are actually done by Eric/Zipper or Eric/Techrat, whereas a lot of the negative Hologram acts are done by Jem or Jerrica directly.

I don't think Jem ever stole. Her whole motivation was saving an orphanage, which is probably why all her more deceitful stuff flew under the radar since her motivations were "selfless". The main thing she did do was lie and cheat thanks to her leading a double life (Kinda like another pink haired character from a currently running cartoon, ne?)
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Offline taffeta

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #29 on: June 26, 2018, 10:03:48 AM »
Finally, on that same subject - the biggest villain in Jem is actually Jem herself, but because she's the good guy, she gets away with a lot of things that are morally questionable (steals, lies, cheats, tries to kill Pizzazz at least twice, to name but a few). The Misfits did bad stuff but were cast as bad guys - ultimately they are the more sympathetic characters because they're flawed and messed up. And they also have limits. A lot of the things that get blamed on them are actually done by Eric/Zipper or Eric/Techrat, whereas a lot of the negative Hologram acts are done by Jem or Jerrica directly.

I don't think Jem ever stole. Her whole motivation was saving an orphanage, which is probably why all her more deceitful stuff flew under the radar since her motivations were "selfless". The main thing she did do was lie and cheat thanks to her leading a double life (Kinda like another pink haired character from a currently running cartoon, ne?)

She stole the earrings from the museum in China. Yes, she believed them hers, but she still stole them...and they weren't hers :)

Her motivations also are not selfless all of the time. The thing with Jem is the dislocation between Jem and Jerrica. JERRICA is the one who fundamentally is pulling everything together, but when she's Jem she often disconnects from her Jerrica responsibilities and thus acts in a less justifiable way. Although even as Jerrica she manages to drive some of the kids to run away at least once. She (and unfortunately the Holograms) are also unbearably stuck up to a couple of random characters - they expect free rides in Venice, they belittle a not very intelligent guy at a (gas station??) I think and they also make fun of the nightclub Pizzazz sends them to on their treasure hunt.

It's easy to morally justify the behaviour of good guys because the series tells you to. When you stop and think about individual incidents, though, they aren't justified by taking care of the orphans. That doesn't require Jerrica to crash Pizzazz's hangglider or her car. It doesn't justify demanding free rides or insulting people. It doesn't justify running off with Riot and abandoning the band and those orphans.

I have no problem with the lying to keep Jem's secret to protect Synergy or when she does it to protect or support her girls. It's the rest of them I have problems with :)
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Offline Fantoma

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #30 on: July 02, 2018, 08:49:44 AM »
 don't remember Jem/Jerrica ever trying to kill Pizzazz. And if she did, it was probably self-defense. Do you remember in which episodes those incidents occurred?

For me, G1 slowly started to end the minute they revealed those atrocious new faces with big round eyes and soft features for Draculaura, Clawdeen & Frankie. It was like getting punched hard in the face with a sledgehammer when expecting a tender soft little kiss on the lips. The ghouls used to be drop-dead gorgeous, fierce, edgy, creative, different & unique. And all of a sudden, they became cute, funny, common, unoriginal & hyper-boring.

There were warning signs... like characters better fitted for Ever After High than Monster High (Mouscedes King, Luna Motthews, just to name those 2) and others that were not monstrous at all (like Isi Dawndancer & Jane Boolittle, just to name these 2), even if they were gorgeous. But they were too fairytale like.

And then, characters started to vanish without warning or logical explanation. And Mattel mostly ignored our questions about the disappearance of those characters. They insisted that none of our favorite beloved characters had been erased from the Monster High family but now, we all know that was a lie. Many characters have gone M.I.A. and have not been seen once in any kind of way, shape or form since the reboot started. It took nearly 2 years for Ghoulia to return. But so many others vanished (Spectra, Jinafire, Honey, Viperine, most of the guys, etc....)

Parents kept complained that the G1 dolls were "scary", way too sexy, unrealistic and also too weird (since when is that a bad thing?), and eventually, the dolls became lame, cheap, boring, poorly designed and executed, uninteresting and lost their edginess and fierceness. Can't believe people Mattel caved in so easily. Now, the whole franchise is brain dead and hooked up on a respiratory machine. It's so sad and heartbreaking.

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Offline Wuvmykitties

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #31 on: July 02, 2018, 10:09:32 AM »
I agree, it really is sad to see Mattel caving to the concerns of parents and other groups who claimed the dolls were "too scary", too "dark" or too sexy. 

Mattel has a habit of repeating their mistakes.  They put out a whole line of dolls and characters for My Scene, then had to make cuts.  They went from not having enough dolls in stores to flooding them and having too many sitting.  Same thing with MH and EAH, they put out a line of dolls, and in the next few years there are 20, 30 or more characters, along with an endless stream of playlines per year.  Then, they have to make budget cuts resulting in limited articulation, one-sided print outfits, and recycled items.  I wish I could tell them, "well perhaps if you didn't insist on pushing so many playlines through all the time, you wouldn't have this problem!"  Even collectors said they could hardly keep up with them all.  Did we really need so many characters?  Or playlines?  When will they learn?

Another thing, and this is just my opinion so take it for what it's worth....
Apparently a lot of small children were interested in the MH dolls.  How many were below the intended age group I don't know.  But why on earth would you label the dolls as for ages 6 and up, when they are meant more for older girls and tweens?  I am curious how many parents actually took that into consideration before buying them for their kids.  Naturally these dolls weren't intended for little kids.  I don't have children but I do have a niece, and I also know a few young girls (ages 9 & 10) who loved them.  I wouldn't give a 3 year old one of the G1 dolls, because of course it might seem too scary or inappropriate for them.  I'm not sure I would give them to a 5 or 6 year old either.  But as kids grow, they learn to appreciate other kinds of toys. 

And really, how "scary" was MH?  Mattel found ways to make the dolls look "scary" and CUTE too, but not "girly" cute (like most Barbie playline dolls).  It isn't like we had dolls with painted-on blood dripping from their mouths, mutilated body parts, or things like that.  Like I said, since when do teenagers have tea parties, play with bugs and/or winged insects, wear ruffly skirts or have huge doe shaped eyes?  In my heart I knew the reboot would never work because of this. (Again these are all JMO)
« Last Edit: July 02, 2018, 01:49:57 PM by Wuvmykitties »
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Offline furyXIV

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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #32 on: July 02, 2018, 02:43:39 PM »
Sometimes I wonder if Mattel heard the term "character based" and thought that meant quantity of characters instead of having a few quality characters people are interested in -_-
Like I kinda get why MH went that route, because there is something interesting about managing to turn a monstrous creature into a cute, but still edgy, character, but then Mattel got too worried about parent reception and the designs jut got boring  :( It may have been better for monster high to just do one doll per character if they wanted to keep adding and adding characters.

I have no idea why they decided EAH warranted 100 characters
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Re: When did G1 end for you?
« Reply #33 on: July 03, 2018, 05:09:01 PM »
For me it was when they revealed the budget dolls, I knew something was off.  I remember that each line had cool designs (outfits, shoes, hair) although sometimes they repeated the same characters (frankie, lala, clawdeen)  :cry: